Don't get me wrong. I just love the trophy that I got . Probably for the quality of the trophy . It will take pride of place at home . And bes ides my car was better than mattts old bomb gricey

so true Gricey. In fact, I think these events should only have one trophy, Peoples Choice. Many will disagree of course.

glenn

Hey Gricey,
How to win friends and influence people.
Glenn,
Agree with your comment 100% maybe peoples choice in all catergories would be fairer.

Geoff

We had a similar conversation on the way home from this years nats.
Our suggestion is to have a sheet to fill out this would basicly mean the peoples choices would jugdge the cars it would be quicker and fair
you would judge gt,sedan and other. Still use a points system. We feel that show and shine as well as judging would be done in no time.
on behalf of some of the qld road trippers.

Geoff was not part of this conversation it was the secon last day of the trip

I agree, although initially i thought just Peoples Choice overall would be enough. If I recall correctly, Peoples Choice is giving a vote to the car you would like to take home.... that could be extended to each category. Judging would then be fast and not tie up judges for a long period. I don't think having a points system would work in this case as everybody would think differently and also would be time consuming. Just an overall impression of the car as the one they 'like' in that category. Most people see a car and think to themselves, "I like that one".

glenn

Glenn the problem with simple outright on each catogory is last years nats we had a tie 5 cars won peoples choice and i won it due to a flip of a coin. Who would have thought. So even though the trophy sits in proud in my house the car was not the only car that was of this class of car.[I HAVE A TROPHY FOR A COIN FLIPPING CONTEST it was a awkward moment for all involved] I am not a trophy hunter Lewis wins fair and square. I do want to keep my cars to a high standard and the fact that we have a little compition happening keeps the cars improving. My old man pr95 restored a gt 25 years ago that suffered neglect and now sits in a shed it's future is unknown. [Glenn a good exaple is your old gt Dave 1968gt keeps this car maintained and as it gets presented for display it is kept in the best condition that Dave can acheive] Nationals and other events with a little healthy compition keeps the cars out there and maintained.
If you would have i.e
peoples ghoice for the 3 catagories gt,sedan,other
Then in all 3 cats exterior,interior,engine bay would avoid a tie. As i said earlier this post my car won peoples choice and it only took 8 votes in total, stickmans donkey got 2votes. Stickman is so proud of his donkey and prefers to keep it in this condition so no offence meant in the coming comment intended but you have 2 grades of cars here and 6 votes seperate them across 30 cars

Only inteded as food for thought. This also takes away the guilt for judges winning as we are all judges this also takes away the conflict of fair judging or unfair judging.

yes, it's a complex dilemna ...... we all want the cars to improve, more to come out of the sheds, more to participate etc.

Some sort of formulae for a Peoples Choice system would be good if all can agree. That also, as you point out, lets the previous judges relax and also have their own cars in the mix too. Winning on a toss of the coin might be avoided somehow also, can't think how just now.....

This is not to suggest that the current system is 'wrong', but allows many, if not all those present, to have an input into the outcome perhaps.


glenn

Agree with you Greg,.
A tie should not occur.
If this situation did develop, to separate cars originality of parts or components and condition would decide a winner, I.E. no brake booster, no chrome plating unless it was when new, no allow wheels etc!
Back to Coona as you said Greg, no doubt the above would have decided an outright winner.
Coona was embarrassing for each of the 5 recipients!

I have received quite a lot of comments on this issue.

IT IS GREAT JUST BEING WITH A GREAT BUNCH OF ENTHUSIASTS OF THE SAME MARQUE!!

I don't think the organizers were comfitable about it either. No ones fault it, in hind sight maybe peoples choice on the 5 cars only As far as original goes that should not be a factor ie a brake booster is a saftey item ? Again there is no simple formular.

Greg knows I take no offence to comments regarding the appearance of Donkey so theres no worries there, eventually Donkey will get his well deserved make over but in the meantime he is much loved and driven almost daily which is testoment to this last nationals trip. 4.5 thousand Km without any hassels and always starts first turn of the key and will sit on 70mph all day long. Sure his uni's are cactus but they were before leaving. His current styling gets many positive comments, some bad but 95% good. We drive though towns in convoy and inevitably Donkey gets the most attention (I love the green hot rod one is a common statement)

Sadley some think little of what I have done or have not done with the car in their eyes, but....... Donkey is on full rego and regularly DRIVEN (hard at that) anywhere and everywhere.
Donkey was judged as a laugh at the nationals but as far as body and panel gaps went he got high marks because beneath the crusty paint and the dead bugs is a very solid and straight car and it takes almost as much effort to get a car to look like mine as it does to get a car to look like Gregs for example (no offence or deminishment of your huge efforts intended mate)

We had a group chat about several nationals topics on our way home and judging process was one of them and no doubt many more chats will result. A peoples choice system may make things a little fairer and aleaviate some deflated emotions or fealings of bias.
Me thinks this will become a hot forum topic over coming weeks/months

One thing to be said though is that the judging in my opinion thus far has been right on the money for the criteria set out and my hat goes off to those given the tough responsibility of splitting hairs in the quallity presented every year.

It's always better to have open, healthy discussion about any issue, especially one like this, as it appears there is a lot of discontent about the standard, criteria of judging. The only way to clear it up is for everyone to HONESTLY say what it is that they find wrong with the system and importantly to come up with workable solutions that will satisfy EVERYONE. On another note, we put a huge amount of time & sheer hard work to get our car ready for what we hoped would be a weekend of Bellett enthusiasts just appreciating the cars in all their standards. We had a ball at the Nationals and on our fabulous road trip, and we hope that this discussion clears the air and leads us all to an even better Nationals experience. By the way, if someone comes up with a judging system that suits everyone they should be put in charge of world affairs;)

well Guys and Gals, To say that I am a little annoyed at some of these comments is an understatement Firstly to 1968GT Dave, I would love to know just why YOU received so many comments after last years Coona Nats judgeing, Surely you should have directed those comments to either the Organisers and or the Judges, and I for one never had any queries ????Secondly to Glenn, Multiple comments from a Guy that has attended just one Nationals and didnt have a Car being judged and so therefore has absolutaly no idea just what the Judges are looking at. And to Rod, Reitterating on what Brett answered to you, NO spending lots of $ Dollars as you put it is not the requirements that the Judges are looking for, I seriously think that a lot of people should go back and have another read of the Judging criteria posted elsewhere on this Forum. Now to put in my 2 cents worth on the Coin flip, "Bloody disgracefull" this was NOT and I repeat NOT the idea of either the Organisers or the Judges, someone said it and almost everyone went along with it. Trust Me when I say that prior to judgeing this year " a tie" was discussed and it was decided that should this occur that all FOUR Judges would rejudge "Tied" cars (providing that they were not there own) and see if we could come up with a clear winner after that. Now for my closing comment, I whole heartedly agree with Gricey, to me the Nationals are not about the trophys ( even though I love the three that I have won) its all about the weekend with great people and looking at all the wonderful cars that are present, And I very much love the medalions that every attendee receives (not that anyone has ever commented on) I personally have a full set that hang with pride on my bedroom wall, If everone wants to drop every trophy apart from Peoples Choice then thats just fine by me Cheers Steve

GROOOVY BABY!!!!!!

FEEEL THE LOVE !!!!!!!

I LOVE HIPPIES !!!!!!

THREE DEEP BREATHS ALL AND PASS IT ALONG...HEHEHEHEHEHEHEH

ALL IS GOOOOD....WE LOVE EVERYONES

MAKE LOVE...NOT WAR...well thats what JOHN LENNON SAID!

Hi Steve,

Secondly to Glenn, Multiple comments from a Guy that has attended just one Nationals and didn't have a Car being judged and so therefore has absolutaly no idea just what the Judges are looking at.

I read the judging section prior to attending the Nats. As far as I know, that is the only detail there is. As I also pointed out, my comments were not a criticism of the judging itself. After all, as you point out, I had no car there to judge anyway so have nothing to gain or lose.. Simply a way to possibly simplify and reduce the workload. I also said that many will disagree with me. Fair enough.

This is the sort of crap that will rip the nationals apart, I thought the whole thing was to bring enthusiasts together for a great week end, and you show me yours and I'll show you mine, not a competition to see who has the best, mines better than yours.
Happens every year, people go away with their nose out of joint, people having a swipe at each other and mine should have won, that one should not have one.
If your not there for the trophy and a only a good time, forget the judging, and stop the bikkering, or if it has to be judged, get someone independant to do it, maybe another club or a car dealer, someone who does not know the cars or the owners, and let them judge it on their own thoughts.

Geoff

Here here Geoff, well said, I agree totally

COIN FLIP COMMENT. Steve i did mention this as a awkward moment for all involved who would have thought that 5 cars would be of choice This was not a swipe at anybody it was a moment that needed to be rectified We did all go along with it at the time. My point of mention was that this would be highly possible outcome
At no point i was bagging the judging either it was something we spoke of if we queenslanders were to consider running a nationals
F.Y.I I am ok with the gt outcome my car was not even complete so Lewis won it fair and square.
At least some people may air there thoughts and if it gets a little rough it will activate the forum

Hi everyone

Thanks for the photos, love the one of Farmer and congratulations to all those who were awarded well-deserved trophies.

Note I used the word "awarded" as in my mind all people who participated were winners in one way or another. These are 40-plus year old cars (when they were new a 40 + yr old car was an A model Ford) and I dare say everyone gave up something, either big or small, to be there. I really loved meeting everyone.

Lets keep our eye on the main purpose - These nationals bring together people from all walks of life, from all circumstances, who share a common passion. To make a very poor pun - they are a vehicle for bringing us all together.

Talking about vehicles, note also the very subtle change in my signature line
YP

That's cool Greg, I never took your coin flip comments as a swipe at the judges anyway mate, it's just something that I did not like when it happened. I just think that some members on this forum need to think about what they are typing, because it could offend others. But Greg I'm cool now and have no hard feelings. I just Love the Nationals and what they have done for the little Bellett and it's family. Bring on 2013, I can't wait !!!!!! Andrew I love your new signature line mate that's "awesome", Peg and myself loved meeting yourself and Suzanne as I'm sure all did, and many thanks for your offer, we will be in touch in the future. Cheers and much Love to all Steve